Dec 10, 2011

Upcoming Series: Why I am an atheist.

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“Why are you an atheist?”

“Why don’t you believe in God?”

I have gotten these questions before. I actually have quite a lot of reasons that I am an atheist, but I’ve found that when someone just asks me point blank I freeze up because I can’t think of where to start. Because I’m not always sure of which reason would be the most effective for the asker to understand, because I don’t usually know their background or what their concept of “god” looks like. While considering this situation, I thought maybe instead of trying to jam my reasons for being an atheist into a single post why not have a series of posts where I can address each reason one by one? So, over the course of the next few months I will be writing and posting a series of essays on the various reasons why I am an atheist.

As a preview, here are some of the reasons I am looking forward to explaining:

  • The conspicuous absence of God, and my repeated observations of God being “given the glory” for human actions and chance events.
  •  The historically dubious origins of Christian doctrines, including early church disputes about the nature of Jesus himself.
  • Moral philosophy and the “Divine Command” theory.
  • The soul: how I became convinced that mind=brain and that the idea of the soul is superfluous.
  • Sexism and injustice in the Bible (probably other holy books too, but I don’t know the other books well enough to comment on them.)
  • The constant replacement of supernatural and religious explanations with understandable scientific ones.
  • Evolution, the origins of life, and creationist lies I was told when I was young.

And this list may change during the series, as I think of other things. If any of these intrigues you, make a note in the comment section and I will try to get to that reason sooner rather than later.

Filed Under: Atheism, Why I am an atheist. · Tagged: , , , , , , , , , ,
Nov 27, 2011

Atheist Satire

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I have found that the funniest comedy is subversive comedy. What I mean is that the best comedy takes the taboo, the holy, and the unquestioned and drags it right out into the open, warts and all, for everyone to see. Makes it not quite so high and mighty. And you see this in politics, from political satirists like Stephen Colbert to court jesters in times past. If you have the skill to make people laugh, you might just get them to rexamine ideas and beliefs that they would otherwise protect with an unpenatrable wall of offense.

Douglas Adams did this for me in the Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy. I was still a Christian when I first read Hitchhiker’s Guide, and I was listening to a very well-done audio book which enhanced the effect of the humor. It’s not like this is a good argument (in fact, it is totally absurd), but it did get me to laugh even if a bit akwardly at the fact that he was basically turning the “Design Argument for God” (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teleological_argument) on it’s head. How ridiculous to say that the unlikelihood that a creature could evolve by chance would prove that God doesn’t exist!

I didn’t become an atheist merely because of this sort of thing, but since it made me laugh by it’s absurdity it got me to lower my guard just a bit. It made the very thought (plausible or not) of God not existing just a bit less threatening to me.

BABEL FISH :

The Babel fish is small, yellow and leech-like, and probably the oddest thing in the Universe. It feeds on brainwave energy recieved not from its own carrier but from those around it, It absorbs all unconscious mental frequencies from this brainwave energy to nourish itself with. the practical upshot of this is that if you stick a Babel fish in your ear you can instantly understand anything said to you in any language.

Now it is such a bizarrely improbable coincidence that anhthing so mind-bogglingly useful could have evolved purely by chance that some thinkers have chosen to see as a final and clinching proof of the non-existence of God. The argument goes like this : “I refuse to prove that I exist”, says God, “for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing.”

“But”, says Man, “the Babel fish is a dead giveaway isn’t it? it could not have evolved by chance. it proves you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguments, you don’t. QED.”

“Oh dear”, says God, “I hadn’t thought of that,” and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.

“Oh that was easy” says Man, and for an encore goes on to prove that black is white and gets himself killed on the next zebra crossing.

Meanwhile, the poor Babel fish, by effectively removing all barriers to communication between different races and cultures, has caused more and bloodier wars than anything else in the history of creation.

(Text borrowed from http://homepage.eircom.net/~odyssey/Quotes/Popular/SciFi/Douglas_Adams.html where you can find many more great Douglas Adams quotes.)

The subversive nature of comedy means, pretty much inevitably, that the best humor is going to offend someone who thinks that certain things ought to remain taboo, holy, and unquestioned. Naturally, not everyone is going to find the same things funny. In the worst of scenarios, where the freedom of speech is not recognised, it might even lead to terrorism, imprisionment, and/or a death sentence for the comedian. (I’m thinking of Dutch cartoons, though there are plenty of other examples.) After the Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy movie came out, one of the critisisms I heard of it was that it is anti-religious. Faith does not like to be taken lightly. I have my own thoughts as to why that is, and you can probably guess what they are, but I will leave you to your own conclusions.

And with that said, I will conclude with a bit of atheistic satire that is targeted mainly at a particular audience: atheists, especially those who grew up in a charasmatic Christian religous environment. It is an atheist version of a “holly roller” revival service in which I was in the audience in Skepticon IV, which I mentioned this in my post on Skepticon from a few days ago.

WARNING: If you are of the type mentioned above who are offended when religion is mocked or satirized, please do yourself a favor and do not watch this video. Seriously.

Filed Under: Atheism, Meaningfulness, Skepticon · Tagged: , , , ,
Nov 23, 2011

On Hosting Thanksgiving in an Atheist Home

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This year will be a big first for me–we will be hosting Thanksgiving in our home this year. We have plenty of space, and we have some time since my husband and I both decided to take vacation on the week after Skepticon. So, for that and for a few other reasons we decided we would go ahead and host the meal here. This will be generally for my family, since my husband’s family lives in Texas.

After getting the OK from my parents, I started going though my head of the things we would need to prepare and come up with a general timeline in which things need to be done. And then I thought, what about the Thanksgiving grace?

Odd, you may think, that an atheist is worrying about the “blessing” but it is actually a big deal to me. Every Thanksgiving meal I have ever attended has involved a prayer of thanks over the food, and even if I have not completely participated in the praying for the last ten years or so I still think it is good to pause for a moment of reflection before digging into the turkey on Thanksgiving. And I want to be courteous to my more religious guest who are probably be wondering what to do as well when we sit at the table.

I hate sermonizing and grandstanding, and I sure did not invite my parents over so that I could push atheism on them. I am thinking of a few options for what could be done for a few moments of grateful reflection before digging in. I just want to have a statement that directs the thanks to people who deserve it, and not to a mythical figure.

  • Saying a few words myself before starting the meal, something along the lines of “I would like to take a few moments on this day devoted to giving thanks to remember that we have all been affected positively by events we could not control, and people we do not know and will never meet. Before we dig in today let’s remember that none of us can take sole credit for where we are in life, and remember that the actions that we take in life will affect others around us in ways we may never know.” Or something like that…I’m still thinking this though.
  • Allow everyone at the table a moment to say what they are thankful for.
  • Have a moment of reflective silence?

If anyone else has ideas of what we could do or say feel free to post in the comments. Especially if you will actually be coming over tomorrow :)

EDIT: As it turned out, I need not have worried. The only formality we followed in the meal was waiting for everyone to sit before digging in, and conversations already in progress blended right into the start of the meal. It would have been akward to inject any kind of a ritual. So it was all good :)

Filed Under: Atheism, Meaningfulness · Tagged: , ,
Nov 12, 2011

My New Christian Friends

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Today I rode about 35 miles on my bike with the Louisville Bike Club, the farthest I have ever rode in a single trip. I almost missed going on the trip altogether because when I arrived at the meeting place to start the ride, I realized that in my hurry to get there on time I had forgotten to grab my helmet and my bike gloves (though the gloves were not a deal-breaker the way the missing helmet was.) I considered giving up and driving back home, but decided instead to hang out and wait for the others and see if anyone had a helmet that I could borrow. As it turned out, someone did. The first people to show up at the ride (and the only ones I saw at the time, since we were not aware that the time had been pushed back an hour to avoid running into the mini-marathon also scheduled for that day) were a very nice married couple who did indeed have a helmet and pair of gloves I could borrow at their house about 4 miles bike ride away. So I rode back to their house with them, feeling a bit naked with only my Buff on my head and no helmet, and got the helmet that I would be wearing for the next few hours. Fortunately, it was a perfect fit and worked well for the rest of the day.

I spent the ride mostly with this couple, since our ride was out of sync with the others in the group due to the change in start time (though this was really no problem at all since the route is the same every Saturday.) There was one little thing about the couple that took me aback just a bit right before we rode to their house to get the helmet. The guy informed me that it was their usual custom to say a prayer before starting the bike ride and asked if this was alright with me. This took me totally off guard, I have to say… at that point I was just so happy that they were helping me out and lending me a helmet for the ride that I was not even going to consider rocking the boat by voicing any kind of objection about prayer. And really, it didn’t matter that much to me at all, so I said that if they wanted to say a prayer that was fine with me.

We didn’t discuss religion at all other than that, though it did come out in discussion that they are members of Southeast Christian Church (for those who are not familiar with Louisville, this is the most famous massive Evangelical megachurch in the city.) I wondered for a while if they were going to try to discuss religion for me, or ask me where I went to church, or if I went to church but they never did. And I wondered what they would think if I told them that my husband and I organize the Louisville Atheists and Freethinkers Meetup, or that I have volunteered as an escort outside the local abortion clinic. I really liked these people and enjoyed riding around town with them, even with the knowledge that we were probably on complete opposite sides on some issues I hold very dear to my heart. Though today it did not matter, and I was perfectly prepared to be straight with them on what my views are if they were to come up in conversation.

After the ride I went to lunch with them, and it did start to get slightly annoyed (though I didn’t show it) when they informed me that they say grace over meals and would this be alright with me? Meh. I’m still fine if they want to say a prayer, but the conspicuous Christianity tactic does get on my nerves a bit. And I wonder if this behavior has anything to do with the Darwin Fish that they probably saw on my car. At any rate, I will still be happy to ride around town with them on future rides.

Filed Under: Atheism, Biking · Tagged: , , ,
Aug 21, 2011

The Atheist Booth at the Kentucky State Fair

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KySS KY State Fair Booth 2011For the second year in a row, there is a atheist-themed booth at the Kentucky State Fair. Last year, there was a billboard sponsored by the Coalition of Reason posted right outside the fairgrounds though the entire month of August that declared “Don’t believe in God? You are not alone.” The billboard is what prompted the idea for us to have a matching state fair booth at the fair, along with a banner to match the billboard (now being displayed in our current booth at the front of the display table.

Last year we got some media attention, mainly around the billboard but also with the fair booth as a followup story. But don’t think we are saddened by the lack of media attention this year–when people are no longer shocked at the “atheist booth” and get used to the fact that we are here, that is a sign of progress.

My first shift at the booth was on Friday evening, from 6-10. The way the shifts are scheduled, there are 2-3 people there for each shift. Just as last year, we have had no trouble at all finding members who are willing to step up and volunteer, and the shift schedule was filled out just about a week in advance of the fair’s opening date. Having multiple volunteers there makes it a lot more fun than if there were only one person, and it is invaluable for moral support and input in case any debates arise, and they always do. There is one main purpose to the booth, to reach out to our fellow secular citizens and let them know we are here. However we also make the most of the discussions with those who disagree with us. With Kentucky being a majority Christian state, we always have people coming by our booth who are not so pleased at our message. The responses have ranged from a puckered facial expression after they read our banner to declarations that “one day every knee will bow!” And of course, we do get asked from time to time if we are worried about hell, to which I would say “there is no hell.” We also have had long and frank and civil discussions about everything from where morals and values come from to the reliability (or lack thereof) of the Bible to whether or not America is a Christian nation. And the way I see it, regardless of the outcomes of these discussions it is a very positive thing for the religious to be in discussions with atheists in person, rather than only hearing what the preachers and the media have to say about us. We are putting a live, breathing, speaking human face on atheism in Kentucky.

And the discussions are great, but the best reward that we see daily are the surprised “thumbs-ups” and the grateful expressions of someone coming by and saying “I thought I was the only atheist in Kentucky.” This is the prize that makes all of the effort and debating worth it.

If you are interested in meeting with atheists and freethinkers in Louisville or in other areas of Kentucky, take a look at The Kentucky Secular Society and Louisville Atheists and Freethinkers.

Filed Under: Activism, Atheism, KY State Fair · Tagged: , , , , , , , , ,
Jul 30, 2011

Offensive?

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The YMCA where I go to take exercise classes has Bible verses up on the walls throughout the building, and has a big nativity scene in the lobby at Christmas. As an atheist, does this offend me? It does not, in fact I feel very little emotion of any kind about it. The YMCA is a traditionally Christian organization and a private establishment. (FYI: I mention this mainly to head off dismissive comments from Christians that any display of Christianity in public view is offensive to atheists.) As long as I am not getting discriminated against or actively preached at while I am there, then it is all fine with me. I am the same way about people posting up Ten Commandments signs or crosses in their own yards, even though for personal safety and sanity reasons I would think twice about moving into such a neighborhood. At any rate displays that are on private property are mostly to the discretion of the property owners and maybe their neighborhood association.

There is a billboard that you might see on northbound I-65 between Elizabethtown and Louisville that proclaims in big and brash letters “HELL IS REAL,” perhaps as a warning to heathens going to Louisville to get drunk at 4th Street Live. I was in Bardstown, Kentucky yesterday and saw a church sign with the rhetorical question “You think it’s hot here?” attributed to God. If I were a theist I might be offended by those who presume to put words in the mouth of God. As it is, I am no longer offended but just simply horrified that there are people out there who actually still believe in such things as a place of eternal fire and torture for those who die not believing in Jesus as their “personal lord and savior.” (Sorry, dear reader, if you are not familiar with fundamentalist Christian beliefs, because I don’t intend to open up the whole can of worms of what that previous phrase actually means. That could take quite some time…)

There are some things that do offend me. Recently I was offended to the very core of my being by the audacity of that terrorist in Norway who wanted to turn his trial into an opportunity to declare to the world that what he did was right and justified. Big kudos to the judges in Norway to opted to deny him the opportunity.

Another thing that boils my blood is any kind of joke about rape, or even the hint of bringing up what a woman was wearing when she was raped as if this made any difference whatsoever. I’m even getting tensed up I write about it.

And, yes, I do get offended when people who make claims that atheists are “attacking America” or that secular philosophies cause the problems of society or other such nonsense. Not just because I know it is nonsense but because it perpetuates a very real prejudice towards people like myself who are atheists and not ashamed of it.

The thinks that most offend me are the things that violate my sense of justice and fairness, such as both of the items above. Things that seriously hurt people. Overloaded rhetoric and actions that has the potential to lead to real fear and violence.

I might feel offended at times from hearing statements where that I strongly disagree.  But I take the view that the mere fact that I am made to feel uncomfortable, or even angry, by some act or statement does not in and of itself mean that this statement ought to be censored or punished. I may be justified in standing up and yelling “I don’t like it!” but not justified in demanding “That should not be allowed!” There must also be some case in terms of legality, justice, and other higher principles that come into play other than “that makes me mad!” In the case of the American Atheists suit against the World Trade Center cross, I believe there is such a case in legal terms and in terms of equality and justice, and it is not merely the case that the cross offends my sensibilities. (See my previous post Opposing the WTC Cross.)

What about stuff like this? (from http://www.unofficialgervais.com/2011/07/27/rickys-rejected-rolling-stone-cover-photo/) Offensive? Why? What do you think his point is?

And here are what I think are the most important questions: If you are offended by this, do you think that it actually does real harm to people and that it should be blocked from all public view? Or do you see your offense as a personal matter of  ”I don’t like it” for your to deal with in your own private way?

Filed Under: Atheism · Tagged: , , ,
Jul 26, 2011

Opposing the WTC Cross

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I remember 9/11, and I remember it well. I was still in college, though on Tuesdays I had no classes. After I got out of bed, I went into the living room where Dad was watching the television, saw the smoking images of the World Trade Center, and thought at first that it was a movie. After watching for a few minutes I realized in horror that this was an actual news report.

I remember the shock and terror of that moment, and for the next few days I felt numb. I remember wondering if the world was coming to an end, or if the United States was going to be taken over by…well I had no idea who at the time. I realized with a shock that if the USA were to be taken over, our revered Constitution would become nothing more than an outdated, historical piece of paper. And then, after a few days as the shock wore off and I realized that neither the world nor the USA was about to end, I noticed a few other things.

There was a great surge in Christian religiosity in the months following the attacks. Not that this didn’t make sense—turning to the sense of certainty and comfort of religion is a normal response for people who suddenly feel frightened and helpless and uncertain of their future. I was right in the middle of it singing “God Bless America” with all the other people I knew…even though there was one factor of the 9/11 attacks that would forever mar my view of religion. It was the fact that the men who flew those planes into those buildings, killing tens of thousands of innocent people, were motivated at least in part by a strong religious faith. I was also deeply disturbed by the reports of attacks against peaceful Muslims, and others who looked like they might be Muslims (including one Coptic Christian man from Egypt), by Americans who were driven to a fury of prejudice and hatred by the actions of a few terrorists.

And I remember the hubbub about this particular piece of rubble from the buildings that just happened to be in the shape of a cross. Now, the state of New York wants to include this broken portion of building support, not as a remnant of the building to help us remember, but as a Christian cross. And not only in its original configuration but carefully air-lifted and placed upon a pedestal. How convenient is it for Christians that their symbol is in the same shape as a common building support?

At any rate, it was not only Christians but all Americans from many religions and backgrounds and ways of life that were affected, directly and indirectly, by the events of 9/11. To me, 9/11 is a reminder of how faith, even though it is a comfort to some people, can also be a force for incredible and tragic harm. I imagine that faith comforted the hijackers as they rushed toward the towers at around 500 miles per hour.

So, should we have a Christian cross, a sectarian religious symbol, as the attraction of the World Trade Center? Does this make the site more comforting, more inviting, more consoling to Christians and less comforting, less inviting, and less consoling to everyone else who may wish to go there to remember? I can’t see how it could be otherwise. This memorial should be something that is for all Americans, not something that divides us by religion or by anything else.

So, for this reason, I stand with American Atheists in opposing the WTC cross.

For more information see http://atheists.org/law/Ground_Zero and http://www.examiner.com/humanist-in-national/american-atheists-object-to-wtc-cross-ask-for-equal-treatment.

Filed Under: Activism, Atheism, Meaningfulness · Tagged: , , , , , ,
Jan 16, 2011

“Spiritual growth”?

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My atheism became known while I will still living with my parents, a couple of years before I increased my independence by moving out. More than once during this period, Mom sent me notes though email or left on my bed to scold, guilt, console, or apparently say anything that she thought might cause me to accept Jesus once again and renounce my disbelief. (It appears to me that this was her motive, at least.) Once, when she realized I was not going to church anywhere anymore (though I had been going various places on my own from time to time, seeking what I could consider a believable faith) she stated in a letter that as long as I lived at home I was required to go to church somewhere (anywhere!). This was part of a larger requirement that I seek what she referred to as “spiritual growth.” I went to the closet church I could find that looked decent, though I saw the things I found unbelievable in Christian faith as much there as anywhere else I went. I stopped going after a few weeks, and the topic was not brought pushed at home again. I don’t think much in the way of spiritual growth was achieved in this way.

On the other hand I think I have achieved more in real “spiritual growth” as an atheist than I did in all my years as a Christian. I have experienced the type of growth that I think I never could have truly achieved within an evangelical Christian context.  I have learned to trust my reasoning abilities, to always strive to learn new things, and to change my beliefs to be ever more consistent with my new learnings. I’m much more likely to think out an issue, come to my conclusion, and trust in that conclusion even against popular opinion until someone rationally convinces me otherwise. The fear of doubt and reliance on authority was instilled in me by the Christian notion that salvation depends on unquestioning belief* and obedience to God. I knew even when I was still a believer that (the wrong kind of?) knowledge and self-confidence could be dangerous to belief and would undercut the authority of those that have set themselves up as speaker for God.

I’ve made it my goal to grow in confidence, willingness to stand out and speak my mind. Willingness to be different. And I have gone though enough cycles of being absolutely convinced of something only to have my mind changed by new information later that I’ve grown in tolerance of the disagreements I have with others over religion and other contentious topics. No matter how convinced you are that you are right, there is always a possibility that your view might change in the future**. Everyone molds their worldview on the experiences and information they have had in their lifetimes, and remembering this is inspiration for humility and compassion for others. I am still working on growing in that area.

*The tradition that I was raised in was somewhat lenient on what was allowed to be questioned, such as the nature of Hell, or whether or not God created everything in literally 6 days. However if you doubted that it was historically accurate that Jesus existed or rose from the dead, or that he was literally both God and man, or that the Holy Spirit was real, your soul was in danger. I was taught directly that you can be as good as person as you could possibly be, but if you don’t believe in Jesus you don’t go to Heaven (and there is only one other alternative.)

**If this gives anyone the idea that I might convert back to Christianity, be sure you know that the amount of evidence that it would take to convince me would be on par with what it would take to convince me that the sun revolves around the earth after all. Possible perhaps, but not very likely.

Filed Under: Atheism, Meaningfulness, Spirituality · Tagged: , , ,
Dec 8, 2010

Ghosts of Christmas Past

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I used to have a Christmas tree ornament that I would hold and ponder at this time of the year. I no longer have it, and I’m not sure if I threw it away, or just left it in some dusty corner of my childhood home. It looked very much like this.

(Image from http://www.booksofthebible.com/p3140.html)

That’s right. A thick, long iron nail (maybe pewter, in this case). The whole point is that back when I was a Christian I saw Christmas mainly as a foreshadowing of the death and resurrection of Jesus. The nail was to remind me of death and sin and blood in the midst of all the cheer and warmth and celebration of Christmas. I would hold it and ponder my sinfulness and complicity in the killing of Jesus (nevermind that the event, if it is not only mythology, happened thousands of years before I was born.) What sweet thoughts.

I used to think that these dreary thoughts were profound and edifying. Now I’m just horrified by the very idea that I ever thought that way. Christmas is a season of hope, though now for me it is about the hope that light and warmth will come again even though it is now so cold and dark. The lights on the houses remind that light is not gone from the world, even if our hemisphere tilted away from the sun’s rays for the time being. This need for hope in dark times is, I think, the root of all the winter holidays. The sun, and our longing for it, is the reason for the season.

Filed Under: Atheism, Meaningfulness, Spirituality · Tagged: , , , , ,
Oct 17, 2010

Science and religious ignorance

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The emerging picture of the early Solar System does not resemble a stately progression of events designed to form the Earth. Instead it looks as if our planet was made, and survived, by mere lucky chance, amid unbelievable violence. Our world does not seem to have been crafted by a master craftsman. Here too, there is no hint of a Universe made for us. -Carl Sagan, from Pale Blue Dot

I am currently reading Pale Blue Dot by Carl Sagan, and I have just finished the chapter called “Routine Planetary Violence.” This chapter highlights the violent history of the solar system, and the creation of rings around the huge gas giants. The thing that inspired this writing was the part about the impact of comet Shoemaker-Levy 9 on Jupiter in 1994.

Unlike many of the events that Sagan recalls in this book, this event happened within my teen years and was all over the news of the day. So I remember it distinctly. I was 14 years old, in the midst of my fundamentalist Christian homeshool lessons from Christian Liberty Academy. I was a committed Christian and a creationist at the time, and was used to interpreting just about everything in terms of Christian belief and the Bible. Including the Shoemaker-Levy 9 incident. So, to my scientifically interested but poorly educated mind, this “shaking of the heavens”* was part of the fulfillment of Biblical prophecy and a sign of the coming rapture. I thought it was a confirmation of the Bible.

Of course now I know it ain’t so, and it boggles the mind that I ever thought such things. But it is not surprising that I did because it was all I knew. The Christian leaders and teachers I trusted talked in such terms, and I was much more likely to distrust the adults that give a more simply scientific account of such events. After all, there are those out there who would deceive us…unfortunately at the time I was mistaken about which set of people deserved the label of “deceiver.”

The Shoemaker-Levy 9 crash into Jupiter really was a perfectly straight-forward, and basically routine (on the timescale of about 5 billion years), scientific happening. I wonder if I would have ever realized that if I had not gone on to get a decent college education and find out the scientific facts of the matter. It reminds me of a woman who came to speak with (actually more like scold and preach at) me at the KY State Fair. She said she knew someone who had died at a hospital and had been brought back to life, and that this confirmed that God was real (or something like that). When I asked her about it (“Did her brain actually die?”) she looked like no one had ever questioned her story before and said that her friend’s heart had stopped momentarily and then had been restarted. Of course, a person’s heart can stop without them dying, as long as it is started back up before tissues start dying of oxygen deprivation. At the end of our conversation she just huffed something about atheists having no hope and stormed away. It’s amazing how a person’s mind can be so clouded by religious mythology and superstition that they really can’t see what’s really going on around them. I was a teenager during the Shoemaker-Levy event but I got over the superstitious thinking by the time I was out of college. This woman was middle-aged. I can only guess that, even that that age, this kind of thinking must be all she knows.

*A reference to Mark 13:25

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